Discussion: Is fashion shipping eating fandom?

[matilda36]

Some discussions I had in the last few days with different people made me think about the fashionability of different pairings.

I am a little bit of a ship slut, meaning that if the pairing is well written, I'll read almost everything (except for child porn), but there are some ships that I find more difficult to accept than others simply because I cannot see the chemistry between the actors. The two main example are Sam/Jack in the Stargate fandom and Buffy/Spike in the Buffy fandom.

But even accepting that I cannot see the chemistry because of my slash glasses, what I have problems with is the way in which fandoms move from one pairing to another are the pairing in fashion. For example in the Buffy fandom at the moment is all Spuffy and Spander, with writers ignored until then winning awards only because they switched pair, and (and the two phenomena are in no way to be linked) bad fic receiving praise only because it represent the right pairing in the right way.

Yes, because there is also a right way and a wrong way to present a pairing. For example I more or less stopped reading Jack/Daniel, one of my favourite pairings, because most of what I can find is Hurt comfort, in which the writers compete to inflict the most painful injuries/illnesses/tortures on daniel, so Jack can kiss it better. Similar fate seem to be happening to Sam/Josh fics in the West Wing, only in this case Sam is the sick one.

If you try something different, or you like something different, you have to dig and explore, (or re-read the fic you love) until your pairing/genre comes in fashion.

I'd like to hear what other people think of this, if it's only my impression or if you had similar (or different) experiences.

There are some people in my f-list (e.g. Bev, Jan and Jape, Moonshayde) who simply decided to create their own spaces, I'd like to hear from you too.

Moonshayde writes beautiful Stargate fic in unfashionable SG1 pairings, if you do not know her writing her latest brilliant effort is here: http://www.livejournal.com/users/moonshayde/167246.html#cutid1

Now, thanks to Sylum, I do have a nice, intelligent and multifandom f-list. Help Foxy understand, discuss.

Comments

[moonshayde.livejournal.com]

Wow, your journal is very Christmassy. I just noticed.

And wow, thanks for the praise. I appreciate that. Kinda stunned. That link is to my latest Gen fic (though I tend to try to create subtext so that if people want to see more then they can). It hasn't gone over very well. I suppose if I had written it as slash so that Daniel was whimpering over the situation and Jack came to hug him, it would have been a success.

It's very much so a fandom related problem. If you aren't doing what is popular at the time, then you're "out." Like in SG-1, currently, the big thing seems to be Daniel/Vala.

I hate Daniel/Vala. Therefore, I am in the minority and excluded from talk that discusses anything that dominates Sg talk, including fanfic.

I'm also a minority in the fact I choose to mainly write Gen. If you don't pick a pairing, then you are out of the game. If you don't bash Sam, you're out of the game. If you don't think Cameron and Daniel are super buddies, you're out of the game.

I'm even a minority in Jack/Daniel, which is the only slash pairing I've ever written. Because I choose not to write H/C or I choose not to write Daniel in a way that feminizes him beyond recognition or I chose to minimize sexual content because that is not my focus, my fic is the aberation. Slash without sex? Are you daft? I guess I am.

So, people, not wanting to be marginalized, turn to the popular pairings and hence badfic is born.

It's not a good place to go. My first Jack/Daniel fic is kind of shaky because part of it was written because it was a true idea and I wanted to, but another reason was because I knew it would be read. After I wrote that fic, and it got lots of praise, I realized I couldn't do that. Any slash fic that would follow would have to be hold very close to my vision whether people liked it or not.

My subsequent slash fics have received little praise ;) I get minimal feedback on my Gen fics. I even get minimal feedback on my ship fics. That is why I had to create my own space. Sometimes it's depressing, but I have to be true to myself, you know?

I find this topic very interesting. I'd love to see what other people have to say.

[misstemperance.livejournal.com]

Ok, first off, yeah I too am a slashy ship whore, I tend to have one or two ships I stick to per fandom (for example in CSI Miami I like Speed/Horatio (many thanks to bjjones who was one of the first writers in this fandom I read) but will steer clear of anything involving Ryan) but if the writer is good enough I'll read just about any pairing once.

That I think is the problem I have with a lot of the message boards out there, if you don't conform to the 'ship' you're not welcome.

there are some ships that I find more difficult to accept than others simply because I cannot see the chemistry between the actors

Oh man do I relate to that one!!!! You have to have some kind of chemisty to make it work. Sam/Jack is a really good example of that, canon (ish) pairing that I never believed, Jack/Daniel one hug and a couple of silly nicknames in how many seasons and I was still totally there with this pairing. The two actors just sparked off each other in a totally believable way. Again with the two named Buffy pairings, could there be less chemisty there? (And having met James Masters I really don't think that it was his fault!) But I have real problems with Buffy as a character so I could be her!

But I do believe that pairings are fashion driven to a certain extent, just look at the explosion of Gil/Nick fics out there post Grave Danger and absolute drop off of Harry/Severus fic in the wake of HBP (not that I think that it would take much to work round the events of HBP but I have always firmly believed that Severus is a much maligned character anyway!). This kind of 'fashion' pairing idea is a little disturbing because so little of it is any good, mainly because like a lot of fandoms people are just punching out the same stories they always used to write with a new pairing and they are just as unconvincing.

Fanfiction should always be about the characters. Yes, I do see the world through slash-glasses but if the pairing doesn't work in you own mind the story is going to fail. I really like the character of Sam in SG1, I do like Sara (tho' she does annoy me occasionally) but pair them off with certain characters and for me it's an instant 'skip story' moment I've see the story fail too often to trust the pairing. (In one of my stories (a stalled WIP sadly, which will likely never see the light of day as it turned out to be too close to Grave Danger, but Gil was kidnapped by Crane and Greg and Nick rescued him) I even had to send Sara on a conference for the duration of the story as I couldn't get in the head of the character enough!). Much as I love AU's (hello Sylum anyone) the ones that really work remember the characters they started with. Too often with me AU simply means original fiction with the names of existing characters, I'm sorry but that's not why I'm reading fanfic!

Eeep! Sorry that turned into a bit of a rant and I'm still not sure I answered the question I set out to answer! *sheepish grin*

[bjjones.livejournal.com]

First off thanks for the compliment.. *Blushes* - But I do know what you mean. I stopped reading half of the Stargate stories because I was tired of Daniel being so girly or Jack so manly man. I like to switch things up and change.

For me I noticed trends. Right now it seems Greg/Sara is the big pairing in CSI. Though I could be thankful its not Gil/Sara :).. I've been on boards and seen the fights. OH God its painful. No Sara's better for Gil, no Sophia, no Catherine.. no she's a whore.. How about Lady Heather ... and so on. Of course as an avid slasher I want to throw out no he's with Nick or Warrick or Greg... Which starts a whole nother argument that slash isn't canon - well duh...

Though I have seen the same debates in the slash world. I admit I love Horatio/Speed - doesn't mean I don't read a good Speed/Eric, Horatio/Eric or even Eric/Ryan - I even read a Horatio/Stetler ... or even try my hand at writing Speed/? ... The idea as a writer is to go beyond your boundraries not conform... If someone doesn't like I wrote a Speed/Ryan they dont' have to read it...

Its the same with stories... I had someone leave a group because they didn't like where the writing of csi miami slash was going - vampires really that is just wrong... its a story - dont' like it don't read it. Don't flame the author don't shun them because they tried a new idea or pairing.. embrace it .. I don't like Nick/Ecklie but you know i read a great story about them... it was well written and I made sure the author knew it..

So my theory write what you want... its for you not others.. if peopel out there find and love it great.. if they hate fine.. who cares... If theres no way Riddick/Eric should be together.. they make one hot couple in my opinion!

[hannibalbronwen.livejournal.com]

*raises hand* Fandom Whore, here. I don't much care about pairings - if it's well-written I'll read it. I do stop at some, but like you, those are the ones where I see absolutely no chemistry between either the characters or the actors or both (depending on what fandom).

I will admit that I like hurt-comfort stories, but only in some fandoms and only in limited amounts. As is obvious from most of my fiction, I like to focus on relationships, not sex. I guess that's part of why I don't get much feedback on them. *shrugs* Oh, well. My sisters both write for themselves. If someone flames them, they ignore it. Their stories are out there because they felt like putting them where others could read them, not because they are desperate for affirmation that their stories are good. I'm the opposite. I constantly question my abilities, but it doesn't stop me from writing.

As for fashion pairings... Some of the current pop pairings are ones that I've liked for a while. Spander is one of those. I like it for the fact that it is easily spotted in Buffy (even my younger sister, who can't stand the pairing can see it - doesn't mean that she likes it). I don't like much het, but I'll still read it if rec'd. In a lot of my fandoms, I have OTP's, but I'm still willing to read one of the members paired off with someone else.

Of course, just because a pairing is made canon, does not mean I'll read it. I refuse to read Cordelia/Connor, Cordelia/Angel or Spike/Buffy, to give a few. It's not because these are het, but because I think that it was a mistake on the producers' parts to go ahead and air them. Child porn bothers me for the most part, but it depends on the definition of child. If you mean anyone under 15, then I refuse to read it. In the HP fandom, I won't read stories involving the students unless they are in fifth year or higher (or, if 14 and with another student - never with an adult).

I very much agree with you that it is wrong for a poorly-written story to recieve praise simply for its pairing. If all I wanted was a specific pairing, regardless of the quality, I'd have a much larger collection of fiction. I'm very picky in the stories I read. I'll read a lot of fluff, OOC, and completely random stories, and some of them I like despite the writing, but most are well-written pieces that I got from my mother (long story).

So, yeah. That's my opinion on it... Sorry if it's babble.

[hannibalbronwen.livejournal.com]

slash isn't canon - well duh...

Well, neither are most het pairings, but don't tell the shippers that. I have no wish to get mauled, ta very much.

[thewaughnman.livejournal.com]

Hey, House here. I have my pairings (both slash and (gasp!) het, but I can bend if a story is good (as an example, I am a CJ/Danny boy in West Wing, but can gladly read CJ/Toby stories).

Problem is, in some fandoms (I won't make names *coughHouseAliasLostWATecccough* if you don't conform to THE ship (S/V from Alias is a pretty good example) you are out. I have been called *mysoginous* (sp?) because I have said that House and Cameron are not good together, in my opinion. [But now it seems that, having shown them I am one of the only two Houses roaming the planet (beware of imitations!) they are back to normal.]

And poor Lauren has been devoured in the Alias fandom... I liked her... and I like Will too, who makes a better partner for Vaughn than Syd will ever be.

In three words, I heart you, guys, because Alias and Lost are the *only* two fandoms in which I am just slashy, and with the Jate-Skate and Sarkney-S/V wars in those, it's a hellish life.